Former Bush Chief Of Staff Says Obama Disrespects The Presidency

this dummie is worried about what the president is wearing in the white house, and not about that 18.4 billion dollars wall street stole under his boss watch, those bonus were to be giving in January, but wall street new that if they did not give them out before president Bush left they would not have a chance to steal that money.

The emperor wears no clothes. I do not care what he wears, but he has NOT earned my respect. I do not like my president having thirteen LAWSUITS against him.

do not like my president having thirteen LAWSUITS against him

Dude, you might need a U-Haul for lawsuits coming against the one's who have earned your respect.

I do not like my president having thirteen LAWSUITS against him.

Brian, please list those lawsuits. Do any of them include the suits about his place of birth? If so, you can cross them off your list; they have all been discredited. Every court, including the Supreme Court, have found them baseless.

Oh Brian get over yourself. I am glad you don't respect him it gives him all the more credibility.

To Brian and many of the hard core Right Wing Republicans. Obama And Democrats will never be good enough.

What they want is to redo the elections? Find ways to prevents people voting for Democrats to not vote. Use the Republican Conservative Supreme Court to steal the elections. Kill all Democrats congress people and replace with Extreme God Fearing Ultra Right Wing Christian White Conservatives Only! They want to keep those specific White in power at whatever the cost and subjugate all minorities, progressive-centrist-liberal whites. Send Gay and Lesbian to be reformed or worst. Keep Minorities in their places. Keep most women at home to be subservient to men with with exceptions. Last, convert everyone and anyone into Evangelical Christians to be manipulated by selective people minister, priest, Decons ,etc.

All Americans were horrified as we say Rev Wright deliver those racist teachings in his church that Obama was a member of for twenty plus years. The new GOP chair is a black dude. Try to keep up with current affairs if you are going to be such a stanch lemming. Just because we have questions and discussion doesn't make us bad radicals.

The new GOP chair is a black dude.

You may call it Window Dressing. Just like during the RNC, the Republicans paraded all the non-whites on stage to show the world their version of diversity.

It is so wrong for African American minister to express racist view, yet it complete OK for White minister to express racist views. Pat Robertson, Jerry Farwell in modern times, I guarantee many of the past president attended Churches with even worst views than Rev Wright.

Name them. You can not because it did not happen. Black Theology is now coming to light. I have not ever seen documentation that Pat Robertson or Jerry Farewell were claiming some very salacious materiel. Prove me wrong.

Claiming all those thing that rev. wright did is racist. Stop hating yourself and get help. Maybe you are a minority and keep playing the race card. I do not know or care, but rev. wright has a DVD espousing racist, irresponsible, divisive, and un-American remarks. Obama attended this church for over twenty years is also a fact.

Aalaf Alot wrote: "It is so wrong for African American minister to express racist view, yet it complete OK for White minister to express racist views. Pat Robertson, Jerry Farwell in modern times, I guarantee many of the past president attended Churches with even worst views than Rev Wright."

The expression of a racist view by anyone is wrong by mere virtue of the definition of racism: the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

So, Brian, I asked you list the lawsuits against Obama. You haven't responded. Does that mean my post got lost in the shuffle or does it mean they are all based on the natural-born crap that has been widely discredited?

Brian, maybe you should listen to what Frank Schaeffer has to say about Rev. Wright. Schaeffer is the son of Francis Schaeffer, a founding member of the Christian conservative movement. His reaction to Wright's sermons was that they were pretty tame compared with the sorts of things conservative preachers had said about how God would condemn America for abortion, feminism, tolerating gays, etc. etc. And their punishment for this America-bashing was invitations to the White House, highly paid speaking gigs, etc. Remember how both Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson said that 9/11 was America's just punishment for its sins? Remember how Dinesh D'Sousa essentially agreed, and said that we had it coming for letting our women get uppity and not wear burkas? Come on. The only thing that makes Wright's "God Damn America" remark so much more offensive to you than the countless thousands of similar remarks from Falwell et. al. is that his black skin scares you.

The race card worked. Cards can work. Get the demoCRAPs spin. Dem's disgruntled people network.

#3;

I thought only children play the disrespect "card",

Surely you realize that this statement is still true...just because one has grown to adulthood years; it does not mean one has to think and act like one!!

;-}

GA GUY,

I know, I just have to read brian's little quip to see that, #3.1.

JohnRussel,

Don't you think you are being a little too liberal with the delete button? I was not the only one who questioned his sobriety or lack of civility. Almost half of his comments were collapsed by the community.

Giving a 'mob' the ability to collapse comments is one of the faults of Newsvine, not something to brag about.

I'm sure you're perfectly okay with giving a 'mob' the ability to take away the rights of others, though.

Giving a 'mob' the ability to collapse comments is one of the faults of Newsvine, not something to brag about. I deleted your comment because it was a specific insult not related to comments on the thread. You have no way to know if Brian was drunk, stoned, or in a monastery when he made his comments.

It appears that you do not agree with the "mob mentality" because you agree with Brian's comments so you deleted mine to get even with the mob.

You have no way to know if Brian was drunk, stoned, or in a monastery when he made his comments.

I just got the fax, he is drunk and stoned in a monastery, in Irvine CA.

Reading your introduction to this article makes it pretty simple were you stand on this issue. It seems to me that most of the deleted comments differ from your view point.

As far as I can see, the vast, vast majority of people who have their 'comments collapsed' are people who dared to take issue with a leftist or liberal position. That is a mob mentality.

I think this statement is further proof of you disdain of people that have different views than you. No problem this article was really of no value anyway. I'll just stay away from your seeds and articles in the future.

JohnRussel,

I noticed why you started deleting comments. You were upset that a few of your posts were collapsed by the community. Telling people to stick a carrot in their backside as you posted is much worse than me suggesting someone might have been hitting the sauce. How hypocritical.

John

As far as I can see, the vast, vast majority of people who have their 'comments collapsed' are people who dared to take issue with a leftist or liberal position. That is a mob mentality.

I believe that's a really big stretch. It all depends on who shows up on a particular vine.

Republican/Conservative vines are as bad as Democrat/Liberal vines

I don't believe the seeder/writer has much to do with it.

Ga Guy, I agree completely a suit can draw attention away from an empty head? Look at wall street? The auto company CEOs? Congress?

Dudes I don`t care if you wear a tutu, do your job correctly! Doesn`t make much difference what the world thinks if the people you expect to elect you think you suck?

Jeans and a flannel, carharts and work boots? who cares! get your hands dirty! do some good work! Some people talk a good job, most of them wear suits!.

The necktie is a 450 year old French fashion afectation, originally adopted by courtiers seeking to curry favor with their monarch - ie suck-ups. It apparently hasn't changed function.

Every crook and bad manager I've ever known wore a tie. Every banker, every lawyer, every politician wore a tie.

When I heard that Bush43 had decreed that no one could enter the Oval Office without wearing a tie, I decided that no matter what the cause, no matter what the reason, during the Bush years I would never enter that room. (I've been there before anyway. :-b)

It's time to toss the tie... for good.

When I heard that Bush43 had decreed that no one could enter the Oval Office without wearing a tie,

Bush always an arrogant a$$ that focused on the wrong thing.

The tie was used to point out a man's manliness, instead of using ones finger to say, "see I'm big down there".

I'm not one of those guys that refuses to wear a tie. I have no problem wearing one when the situation calls for it, though I reserve the right to use the thing for a little self-expression ( Looney Tunes ties and so on may be tacky to some, but can be a great "bite me, I'm meeting your dress code" to the pompous asses out there ).

Some interesting origin theories here. I've often wondered who came up with the idea. I always figured it had something to do with saving time building a gallows for a man who ticked off a king in public. "You have insulted His Majesty's honor!" ( Yank...choking sounds )

Yosho: Grin! Great theory -- but in all seriousness, I heard that the purpose of the tie was to keep the shirt from gaping open at the neck to reveal the undershirt and/or chest hair of the wearer. I could be wrong, but that's the story I heard. Speaking as a female, I know that there are two reasons to wear a scarf: a) it's cold out, and silk is warm but light, or b) the top you want to wear has a lower neckline than your cleavage really merits.

that is what he is saying, that the president was smart enough to put on some clothes without Cheney telling him to. president Bush wanted to look like he was smart.

Remember in the old days. Men had to wear suits on a airplane, in restaurants and various other places. In the 1940 to 1950's, you practically had to wear suit to conduct business in many major cities like New York, Philadephia, etc.

I can't imagine living in that time.

The world had change, nothing wrong with business casual.

This is just a distraction. The Bush haters can not let it go and get over it. What Obama wears is his business. Why the big deal?

Usually the first marker for a president is their first hundred days. Settle down. Lets pay attention to what he IS doing like the cabinet appointments, etcera.

For that matter, there was a time when no respectable woman would be seen in public without her whalebone corset.

NO HOW, NO WAY, GUYS!! And forget the burka while you're at it, okay?

Who actually expected Obama to have any class?

Obama is actually top of his class with honors.

Better Question:

"Who actually expected Andrew Card to understand what ""class"" actually is"?!?!

Class? Like he who spoke with forked tongue?

Hahaaaaa....owned!

Simplistic Reality

Got anything constructive?

Bush and his ilk had class like Paris Hilton has class -- that is, money can't buy it.

I guest the "racists bigots" didn't expect President Obama to have class. But all the rest of us with common sense & an IQ knew he had "class." It was his class (including running a historical campaign to be copied for yrs to come) & the lack of class spewing from the other side that caused many to cross-over because they too wanted a President who had class (top of his class at Harvard) & spoke English not "folksie cute wink talk."

To add to WhoseAngry point!

My guess Mr Card, some of those Republicans and Bushies Whiners want Obama to dress like a proper African American Servant working for a rich White Family in White House. Colored Butler saying, Very Good Sir. I should dressed like properly like Close Minded intolerant Right Wing Republican Conservative.

All of Obama's records are sealed so we do not know anything about his standing in class or anything.

I like the symbolism of rolled up sleves better than "button downed" symbolism.

The work Obama has done so far is of very poor quality, but hopefully it will get better.

Brian-657672: All of Obama's records are sealed so we do not know anything about his standing in class or anything.

Man Brian are you just full of @!$%# or what? He graduated Magna Cum Laude from Harvard and was elected editor of the Harvard Law Review as a sophomore...anyone who actually went to college would know this is quite the achivement, attainable only by a to 10 student at Harvard. While he may not have been #1, he certainly wasn't #30 in his class.

Your boy Bush barely made it out of Yale, a C student who never even earned a spot on the dean's list.

While academic performance isn't everything, if you're going to use it to support a baseless argument then people like me will have to slap you in the face with the long arm of the truth.

Put some ice on that eye son, before it gets all swollen...

Occidental records sealed. Columbia records sealed. Harvard law records sealed.

Your a real tough guy in cyber space. Anyways I have done many things while I was in pain for people like you who sit comfortably blogging nonsense. Bring it on *(*(%%&^%&^%(*&(%(%(*%*(&&*^*^%^%%@^))*.

well that tells you what hes report card said and he studied law it must be a coincidence that the biggest crooks are attorneys .

Obama is just an impeachment waiting to happen .

and the people that elected hem weren't wanting a Chang thay wonted a Chang of color and that is the only reason he is in office

he was useless as a senator and he is useless now

Brian - you're making all that up. All of his information is public record as is Bush, and every other president before them.

I don't have to be tough...see I'm educated and informed; so I'll forever be a step ahead of the majority of people who are already 10 steps above the large number of people significantly above your level. You can use scratch paper to figure that one out if you need to.

If you served in the military Brian then thank you for your service. But you really should've used that e-Army service they have and learned something during your downtime.

Real world - are you serious? Congrats on finding a way to make a post in crayon on the vine.

Thank God for genetic diversity...

the real world wrote:

Obama is just an impeachment waiting to happen .

and the people that elected hem weren't wanting a Chang thay wonted a Chang of color and that is the only reason he is in office

he was useless as a senator and he is useless now

What is so confusing about the word "real" that its meaning eludes some people?

No you are wrong about the records being sealed. When Obama went to Hawaii when his grandma died he made sure his birth certificate information was sealed. All records on Obama have been sealed, college or birth, or provide info that counteractsthis. The Hawaiian certificate of live birth is not a birth certificate according to the State of Hawaii's website. The only educational information available is when he attended school in Indonesia as Barry Soetoro junior.

The question is; would it matter to you if Obama was a foreigh national? He could not get an American passport until he became a senator. That is also a fact. It surprises me when I hear strong advocate of someone when they apparently have no idea of them. That is a marketing strategy.

Brian,

Even extreme conservatives like David Horowitz contend: "The continuing efforts of a fringe group of conservatives to deny Barack Obama his victory (over a fabricated question of citizenship)...is embarrassing and destructive. The fact that these efforts are being led by Alan Keyes, an unhinged demagogue...who in 2004 lost an Illinois Senate election to Obama by 42 points, should be a warning in itself.

I repudiate your and their fraudulent positions lest others take them as factual.

Jerome Corsi of Swiftboat notoriety, promoted the lies regarding Obama's Birth Certificate, lies such as, "it doesn't have a raised seal," "It's not signed," and others. The certificate and other related documents can viewed at http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html. If you have any integrity at all, you will go to the link and then report what you saw there.

You also wrote: "The Hawaiian certificate of live birth is not a birth certificate according to the State of Hawaii's website." This is playing with words.

Obama was born to a white American mother, Ann Dunham, and a black Kenyan father, Barack Obama, Sr.,- both students at the University of Hawaii. When his father left for Harvard, she and Barack stayed behind, an

Obama's mother remarried an Indonesian oil manager and moved to Jakarta when Barack was six. He returned to Hawaii, and was raised mostly by his grandparents. The family lived in a small apartment - his grandfather was a furniture salesman and an unsuccessful insurance agent and his grandmother worked in a bank - but Obama managed to get into Punahou School, Hawaii's top prep academy. His father wrote to him regularly but visited only once, when Obama was ten.

Obama attended Columbia University and later became a community organizer for a small Chicago church-based group (three years), helping poor South Side residents. He then attended Harvard Law School, and in 1990 became the first African-American editor of the Harvard Law Review.

He turned down a judicial clerkship, choosing instead to practice civil-rights law back in Chicago, representing victims of housing and employment discrimination and working on voting-rights legislation. He also began teaching at the University of Chicago Law School.

So Brian - why did I bother to post all of this? I did so to create a contrast with your hit-and-run, no information, characteristically ill-informed right-wing, lying B.S. .

Other than the criticisms contained in my commentary, your "contribution" was flawless.

Should you respond, do so with some integrity and class. Any damn fool can repeat lies.

Brian is a digital liar...nothing more. I think its embarrassing to see a human being, who should be capable of rational thought, stoop to the level he has simply because he refuses to accept the truth.

Dislike Obama if you want, it is a free country...but don't make up lies and bull@!$%# to support your position. It embarrasses us all.

We did. You keep bringing it up, just like you just did. We want to reciprocate.

I am suspicious of men who wear ties and women who wear pointy toe shoes and clothing that show their boobs. (What were they thinking?) As seastar stated they are invaribly phonies. Times have changed and those who wear these types of clothing seem so passe.

A tie and jacket is a costume that may be appropriate at a formal party.

IMO, when the temperature is near 100 degrees, people wearing a tie and jacket look REALLY stupid.

As a person working in upper management and throughout out the years, I have interviewed many people for various jobs up to my upper management level. As Seastar pointed out, many of the impeccable dressers are not the best employees.

A few years ago, I interviewed one of the sloppiest dressed person ever. He wore a thrift special suit from the early 1980's. This guy hair was messy, unpolished shoes and has eye residue. But, he was extremely impressive. He knew his material, jobs requirements and even provided some procedures and process to improve our company performance. We hired him over some more impeccable dress candidates.

He did wonders for our company. He did such a good jobs, we lost him to another competiting firm in which he because CEO. As CEO, he merge our company, with his and 2 others. Luckily, he has his wife and administrative assisstant to help him attire.

Impeccable dressers are often the biggest phonies.

Yep, not all the sheep were fooled by the wolf dressed up as one of them.

Thats right, how dare he! What in hell did those guys know about respect? Bush all but pissed on all of us, left our country worse off and they are trying to tell us how Pres. Obama should run his office!!!! Note to the Bush administration, want to learn about respect? Roll the tape of two million Americans on the Mall 1/20/09 booing Bush simultaneously as he walked out. Thats earned DISrespect.

BTW, I do not remember any thing in press throughout last 8 years about George W Bush being impeccable dresser.

I don't remember seeing George W Bush on the list of any 10 best dress people.

My guess, Mr Card, Republican Anti Obama Whiners are still in love with Palin. They don't mind having Palin and Family $250,000 wardrobe. After dressing up the trailer trash into their version of a super hot model along with her grasp of English language, her superior unintelligent mind, etc. Obama has dress up to Todd Palin level while dropping down to their trailer trash mentality.

Still plenty of hate from the left wingers. Nothing more to say? Why not try some positive statements? President Bush's excellent handling of the economy and my ability to read and capitalize have allowed me to retire waaaayy early.

Hopefully your guy will do the same for you, but ever since he took office the economy has deteriorated on his watch so much because he is making bad decisions. I think it is going to get much worse also, and so I do not spend as much of my money as I used to, but I can get used to that.

The wardrobe thing: Palin criticized for being a typical woman that spends way to much on clothes, and Obama for bumming around. Too many complainers.

President Bush's excellent handling of the economy

Well, if he really did do that, then we probably wouldn't be in a recession now...

Hopefully your guy will do the same for you, but ever since he took office the economy has deteriorated on his watch so much because he is making bad decisions.

It's only been 12 days since President Obama took office, the economy will not be fixed overnight.

Do you not realize that people are still making money hands over fists. Not just the D.C. and New Yorker folks, which is a bastion for DeMoCrAts who ran congress over 90% of the time since WW II, but people that are smart enough to figure out how to make money. No I am not like, the super liberal president, and have two of my closest advisers as tax cheaters.

Your are right. The economy will not be fixed over night and at least twelve days because all the decisions towards the economy were harshly wrong. He is making horrible decisions all the way around, cabinet picks included. The economy, which it is now his watch, is sliding because the people of the world that matter will punish us for making a stupid decision and electing a foreigner as our president.

Brian

The economy, which it is now his watch, is sliding because the people of the world that matter will punish us for making a stupid decision and electing a foreigner as our president

what?

Brian, Have you looked at what your investments did over the past year -- under Bush? Most of the people I know, including elected Republicans, have had their retirement savings eroded. Many of them are rethinking their decisions to retire. I'm glad you are doing well. You must be one of the top 1%. The rest of us are suffering.

No. I realized an opportunity, took a big chance and won. I did retirelast year waaaaayyyy early for my age.

90% of mortgage holders could go down to their county building and ask for a re-assessment ( tax assessment ) of their house. This will probably save three or four times what the stimulus package gave you once year after year. There is just one tidbit for financial security. Depending on where you live it could be three thousand dollars a year, year after year for as long as you own that home.

There are more super rich democrats than republicans.

I think, Brian, the re-assessment projections you made are based on where you live. In my area, homes are re-assessed every two years. Next year, my property taxes will go down without my having to go to the County Assessor (someone I know) for help. But, as the housing market recovers, my assessment will go up. (Some states, like CA, do not allow for property tax increases based on home value, but most states do.) And, I would add, decreases in property taxe revenues will affect schools, police, roads and many more services you use every day without knowing it.

You got lucky. You are not with the rest of us. We are suffering, some more that others. Yes, my net worth went down considerably last year, but at least I have a comfortable job with good benefits. I'm having to tighten my belt. I work longer hours to help out my employees (I'm exempt, so no overtime.) But I have a job; many do not.

It would seem to me that someone who is as well off as you are would be able to afford a little compassion for those who are not as well off.

And, Brian, Obama was born in Hawai'i, to a natural born US citizen. He is a natural born US citizen, not a foreigner. Be careful, you are sounding less than knowledgeable as well as less than compassionate.

California's prop 13 limits the increase in property tax to two % per year. A twenty percent drop will take ten years to get back to the originalassessment. It is still your house and you do not have to give the government so much of your money which empowers them even more than they already are. I want smaller government. I have worked very hard my whole life starting as a paperboy and being actively employed, volunteering, and holding appointed positions for the public.

I saw on world net daily that a new lawsuit was filed in regards to Obama's citizenship. I do not think anybody, but Obama knows for sure. The lawsuits are still mounting like the Air Force officer that wants to know if Obama can give him a legal order. There are a whole bunch of military people filing lawsuits.

Obama has to prove to the masses that he is legitimate. He has not done that to many peoples satisfaction. I do not need a source, as I have my own, but find peoples lack of curiosity very unsettling.

Obama has to prove to the masses that he is legitimate.

Because being voted in as the president of the United states lacks legitimacy?

I used to humor people like you. Lifes too short.

ignore

I saw on world net daily that a new lawsuit was filed in regards to Obama's citizenship.

First of all, is world net daily even legitimate? Don't they focus on issues like big foot and alien babies? Second of all, there have been a number of lawsuits filed in regards to Obama's citizenship filed -- and all were dismissed as baseless. There is no evidence to suggest he was born any place else but Hawai'i (and a birth certificate from Hawai'i is excellent evidence that he was born in Hawai'i) and no one doubts his mother's citizenship. He is a natural born US citizen. Subject closed.

I wonder if Nero had suit jacket on while playing the fiddle as Rome burned?

Who knows, but Bush wore a jacket (and literally ate cake with Mccain) while Katrina victims drowned in their homes waiting for him to send help.

Bush, as the federal representative, was the last resort for help. Help yourself first. Then your local municipality. The county. Then the state. New Orleans was only one of hundreds of municipalities hit by Katrina. Katrina is over with so get over it also.

Katrina is over with so get over it also.

but just like several other situations and circumstances, the residual effects of those decisions are not over. Many of our fellow citizens there are still suffering. Sitting up to your tail in water, FEMA sends you a trailer that is made with ...what???? the stuff they embalm you with? That is a subtle message don't you think???

Folks are now gonna see whatta great job the Bush USDA dept did...this peanut thing is not going to go unnoticed.....

Nitpickey. Goes to show you can not count on anybody, and should not expect for somebody to bail you out. The big easy residents were stupid for staying there, and should be fined for interfering with the brave first responders. Those responders wasted their time on people that should not have been there.

There you go having to blame President Bush. Get a life. Our food supply has been contaminated for thirty years. Everything you eat is bad. I do not worry about it because there is nothing I can do about it.

That was well proven by the audieces at the DNC and RNC last year.

Hey, Not Over It, haven't seen you in while just wanted to say, Sup.

phoenix - I'm just puttin' in my 2 cents worth. Sup with you?

Keep up the good work. I wrote a little article 8 things about where I am from (Chicago), I was tagged, check it out, it was really very fun!

peace, phoenixrising

I'll check it out. Good to meet up with again!

Republicans are much more charitable then their counterparts who like to spend others money.

Brian-657672 wrote: "Republicans are much more charitable then their counterparts who like to spend others money."

It's time you and I had a talk, Brian; Much of the charity given by Republicans goes to faith-based institutions that operate tax free yet involve themselves in politics in ways that prevent them from losing their tax-exempt status. Deceptive religious folks.

If you want to talk "spend others money," o.k. . The Iraq war is being subsidized by loans from China. The tax breaks for organized-wealth, many of whom are the thieving pigs of Wall street that caused the global recession, are subsidized by Bush's raiding of the Social Security Trust Fund. The "other people's money" required to get us out of the mess, is that of my children and grandchildren.

That you are an apologist for Republicans (who are now trying to sabotage the fix of the mess they got us into) is your prerogative. That you are frequently apologizing for them without any specifics to back up your persecution complex is to your detriment.

You have the right to pick a side and state your case; but you frequently have nothing specific to back up your finger-pointing. An example is the quote of yours with which I began this comment.

Republicans are much more charitable then their counterparts who like to spend others money.

Source please. (I asked this once before. The response was to blame me for asking but no sources were listed. So, before you attack me again -- I have never heard any stastistics about charitable donations by party affiliation. I would be interested in seeing what those statistics show.)

Philanthropy dot com has an article by Ben Goose, and another author Arthur C. Brooks. I am surprised that you can not find these things out when you appear to be the brightest star in the room.

The democrats are not giving away their money at all. Joe Biden gave to charitable organizations in his career less than 250K. Cheney gave over 7 million when he was in the White House Alone. That's more than all the national democrats combines during this time frame. Democrats like to spend others money, and redistribute wealth. Philanthropy web sites tell all, but specifically for your questions those two authors will provide you with the specifics. I do not like saying the truth.

Wearing a suit may be a time honored tradition to you but that doesn't mean that it is a time honored tradition to everyone else. It is not like Obama is wearing ratty old jeans that fall off his butt with his underwear hanging out.

Attire is not the only way to have respect. Obama is an intelligent person, great orator, compassionate, and hard working individual. He respects the people in this country and the people in other countries. I think he has a greater respect for others than Bush did, even though Bush wore a suit everyday.

You are those I spoke of and did so in a manner of respect that you can't even show in response. When you get older and watch the generation behind you then you will understand. My feeling. Obama is a dangerous man and has a agenda which you can see is slowly unfolding. I hope I'm wrong but believe the USA in 4 yrs. will not be the USA we know today and I am not talking economicaly.

And your opinion is based from the clothes he wears?

#16;

This is not about the man.

Read the title of the article again...

You have proved my point. Your generation knows nothing about respect. Come back in 20 yrs. and lets see where you are at.

Wall street guys have purchased lots of new suits with our bailout money.

Now that's respect!

Are we not talking lipstick on a pig here?

I wonder if the waterboarding guys wore their dress uniforms...never mind...wet clothing cannot for long retain that crisp, efficient, credible look we crave.

A. Mac - Stop you're making my side hurt! Hilarious!!

Joe - You don't even know me. You can not claim that I do not have respect. I have a lot of respect for those that I deem worthy.

My respect is not doled out based on the clothes people wear. I respect people that can't even afford nice new clothes. They might even have a little dirt under their over-grown fingernails but they are pure, honest hard working people that I have a tremendous amount of respect for.

I bet you don't even associate with people like I am describing let alone talk to them and get to know them.

You have proved my point. Your generation knows nothing about respect. Come back in 20 yrs. and lets see where you are at.

I'm in my forties and have never worn a suit and tie except to funerals and had to borrow them on those occasions. In twenty years I can guarantee that I won't be wearing them and don't hold it against the president if he doesn't either. If he does a good job, I wouldn't care if he wore jeans and work boots while he's working like myself and the people I work with. It has nothig to do with respect. It has to do with being who you are and not putting on a false front. He spent a good part of his life in Hawaii. I have to say thinking back on my visit there, that I don't remember anyone in a suit jacket and tie except maybe in my Grandfather's church on Sunday. And those were worn by the tourists. He didn't campaign on a promise to always wear a suit. He promised to roll up his sleeves and get to work. Let's give him a chance and stop harping on every little detail.

Respect is earned not given because of the clothes you wear, I have more respect for a farmer in dirty clothes, a worker in boots with holes in them, I ain't got no respect for the suits who lie and cheat and steal.

Well said Fausts son!

My question to those who favor a suit and tie:

I fully respect the men and women in the military...Would you have them fight a war in Class A's and Dress Blues since (in your opinion) the clothes make the man or woman?

Joe says:

To me Obama's attire shows not only disrespect but also a sense of arrogrance on his part.

arrogance: an attitude of superiority manifested in an overbearing manner or in presumptuous claims or assumptions I think you should say what you really mean. Obama choosing to work without his suit jacket is not arrogant. I think that what you are asking him to be is pompous. Pompous: characterized by exaggerated stateliness; pretentious, as in speech or manner; self-important Bush 43 suffered from both arrogance and pompousness both have resulted in the tarnishing of the American reputation.
If the best criticism you can come up with is whether or not he is wearing a suit jacket or some other silly trite complaint, we'll take it.

Sadly I see no respect from younger generation for anything our generation believe to be sacred and traditional.

That's because time moves forward not back, in the words of the prophet, Kahlil Gibran:

On Children
Kahlil Gibran

Your children are not your children.
They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.
They come through you but not from you,
And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.

You may give them your love but not your thoughts,
For they have their own thoughts.
You may house their bodies but not their souls,
For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow,
which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.
You may strive to be like them,
but seek not to make them like you.
For life goes not backward nor tarries with yesterday.

You are the bows from which your children
as living arrows are sent forth.
The archer sees the mark upon the path of the infinite,
and He bends you with His might
that His arrows may go swift and far.
Let our bending in the archer's hand be for gladness;
For even as He loves the arrow that flies,
so He loves also the bow that is stable.

Obama is the new, America's child ushering in progress, tommorrow, not yesterday. I understand your nostalgia but we must move forward.

Lets be concerned with things that really matter, poverty, war, disease, employment, education, enligtenment, PEACE! etc.

Great post phoenix! Thanks!

Haven`t been to church in a long time, did Jesus wear a suit? Build a crystal palace to him self? Like some churches? When the people that go there start thinking it`s about how good they look when they attend? Instead of what they do when they don`t?

Yes suits are for sinners too.

Your generation knows nothing about respect

Repect is something you earn, not something someone else or another generation dictates.

This whole thing about Andrew Card and the deal with Obama not wearing a jacket, well then let's look at George W. Bush's choice for his Official President Portriat to be shown at the Presidential Portrait Gallery.

Bush's Official Portrait

Funny thing that.

Zing Brian.
Say you what?

Thanks Davetopper

It's so Bro

# 18.1;

Business attire , for executives,

Is what the NEW CHIEF EXECUTIVE SAYS IT IS!

I am 50+, have worked in and out of Corporate and Government offices all of my life. Corporations and Government offices change their policies on dress codes all of the time; back and forth. To accuse someone of disrespect because they do not believe as you do, is quite simply just another form of unfounded bias.

The New President has instituted new rules...it is within his purview to do so.

Your straw man reasoning basis for calling him disrespectful, is actually itself disrespectful of the office...and the man.

#18.3;

Actually, right now, the "Office of the President" DOES belong to Barack Obama; and the people who voted to put him there above all other competitors for the position.

"Tradition" is defined as accepted custom; but ALL traditions change over time. It is for certain no one is wearing wigs and knee britches in the Oval Office today.

Your arguement about "suits" for all prior 43 DOES NOT HOLD WATER!

Obama is the new CHIEF EXECUTIVE, and YES; that means he gets to make the call!

Someone apparently decided wigs and knee britches was not a requirement at some point in history!!

Is it telling that your response did not refute the point that Andrew Card is himself being disrespectful?!?!

because saying it over and over again makes it so.

It seems that the preponderance of votes on the comments to your seeded article tend to agree with me.

Is everyone posting here that does not agree with you "wrong"?

18.8:

#1;

Newsvine is Newsvine, and last time I checked, there is no question about support for Obama when you sign up.

#2;

I would posit that Andrew card and those of like mind are actually the ones being "hypersensitive". As to "varying levels of argument"; I always try to stay "on topic", unless responding to a post that seems directed at me, that has used "off topic" materails in refute of my post(s).

The last comment in your post would seem to better apply to someone unwilling to see the fallacy of the seeded article's author's premise, even when faced with the preponderance of article and comment votes in opposition to that premise.

In my opinion, it violates the sprit of the Newsvine COH, even if it does not violate the "letter" of the Code.

I realize that I also violate that sprit of the COH in simply implying that you turn that comment around and apply it to it's writer.

So; let's agree to take this entire conversation back up a notch, and keep our disagreement civil.

BTW; there is MUCH that I personally disagree with Obama on...but I tend to focus on policy, not perceptions.

18.10;

Personally I would be more interested in Card's opinions of where he personally went both right and wrong during his tenure with Bush.

His opinion, your opinion, and my opinion of Obama's office policies are ALL just opinions.

I thought that you posted this article to garner the opinions of your fellow viners.

I post articles and seeds, and trust me; not everyone agrees with every opinion I have either. I do not expect them too, that's how I continue to learn at my advanced age. I continue to listen, and re-form my opinions based upon the opinions of those I decide have valid points for consideration.

I applaud you taking a stand and putting your opinion out here...I just don't happen to agree with this particular opinion. I have seen other posts from you in my travels on the vine, that I actually agreed with!

What I am seeing in this thread are people who would bend over backward and stick a carrot up their hindside if Barack Obama asked them to. It's pretty funny.

And for many a carrot would fit easier than a unsanded louisville slugger that bush has pushed up over the american people over and over and over again but maybe just maybe we can let it return to its normal function.

Furthermore since president bush conducted more business out of the white house should he have worn a suit while feeding the chickens or feeding america cow manure.

JohnRussell

You are wrong. You are wrong. You are wrong, Period.

John you're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong. And that's all there is to it. You're wrong. End of story. Period.

Just because you don't agree with him dosen't make him wrong. I also agree dressing professional is appropiate for the white house. This isn't the country club hang out after a few drinks. This is the White House. Look and dress the part... or get the frack out.

Simplistic reality: It's "dressing professionally." Adverb, not adjective. It reflects profound disrespect for the office of President to use careless grammar.

Since when is a button-down shirt and tie with suit pants "unprofessional" as long as the suit jacket is hanging nearby if needed for a meeting or conference?

Really, its not like he is in cut offs, t-shirt and sandals....

The point is that he raised the temperature, and burns an enormous amount of fuel to keep warm when millions of Americans are freezing. Egomaniac.

Thanks tyler!

I was troubled by the collapsed comments and appreciate your help with this.

JR;

I do not think most folks are arguing the "logical line" you mention; more that they are arguing against the "logical line" you have adopted that being seen in the Oval Office without "Coat and Tie" is "disrespectful of the office".

None of us have seen enough of Obama's policies yet to be comparative of anything but his campaign promises...I think I stated before that there is much he would find me critical of...

I do not "hate Bush"; but I AM glad he is GONE!

I see it as if Obama wants to roll up his sleeves in get to work. Have at it.

Ok John Russell please look at this and then comment (Link) This is the Oval Office I think of.

John,

I don't think you see the article the same way most of us do. Card says that they way you dress in the office shows respect for the Oval Office; we are saying the way you treat the Constitution is a more important indicator of respect of the Office of the President. So, tell me, John, which is more important -- how one appears or the job one does?

You know, I still haven't found "Bush Derangement Syndrome" in my DSM-IV(TR). Is there a newer version I haven't heard of?

Your right. Put the baby in a suit. What was I thinking.

No we were talking about allowing a guy to work in what is now his office. People voted and have given him the use of the office for the next 4 years.

Yes I said he was allowed to use the office. What part did you not understand?

Okay, I can understand both sides of the conversation, really I can. But if tradition is the biggest reason why Obama should be wearing the jacket I don't really follow. Traditionally (at least by some meanings of the word) he wouldn't have been voted into office. I don't mind if a few traditions are bent or broken, it's not like in this case they're lost. I'm sure there are many times where Obama could be seen in the Oval Office in a jacket, but if the President of the United States doesn't really feel like wearing a jacket I'm pretty much fine with it, so long as he wears pants and a shirt (seriously, it's difficult not to make a Clinton joke here, and I respect the guy for a least some of his decisions).

According to what I read in the article he was dressing more casual on the weekends, and more casual means short sleeves and no jacket, not tee shirts and sweats for Pete's sake. Geez. I really don't think that means he is disrespecting the office, he is dressed appropriately during normal busness hours when he would expect to have meetings, and would also be dressed appropriately when meeting dignitaries and such.....

Speak for yourself. The liberal Hollywood crowd spends millions on their jewels but everything else is OK. Won't walk down the red carpet unless I am wearing a five figure outfit. Hypocritical!

Brian,

Could you possibly explain your "comparison/analogy?" It's apparent you didn't understand mine.

Hollywood folks spend their own money on jewelry or whatever and have no direct responsibility for the citizens of the country. If you need me to explain the metaphor of "a broken, twisted, ineffictive, stolen stick," just say so. Otherwise, your comment seems to betray your intellectual shortcomings.

Hollywood is very political, and has more political activists for liberal left winged agenda now more than ever. The list is long and has been around for a long time for democrat people, never republicans. Actors are role models that kids try to emulate.

I could care less what the Obama's wear, and figure this to be a set-up for the jumping off point for his wife to make some big media thing. Please explain your steck.

Brian,

You mean actors like Ronald Reagan, Clint Eastwood, Sonny Buono? Or maybe sports stars like Jim Bunning or Lynn Swann; maybe you mean Ted Nugent or maybe Toby Keith. See anything of interest in that list?

And you didn't respond to the question I asked regarding - Hollywood folks spending their own money on jewelry or whatever and having no direct responsibility for the citizens of the country. If you need me to explain the metaphor of "a broken, twisted, ineffictive, stolen stick," just say so. Otherwise, your comment seems to betray your intellectual shortcomings.

Being political is their prerogative as it is ours, but to compare the implications of how celebrities dress in public vs. the significance of presidential clothing choices in the Oval Office doesn't seem logical.

If someone else can tell me that I am missing something, I'll back off.

Or a heck of a lot of desire and vision.

If one shows no respect they will get no respect.

To whom is he showing disrespect by not wearing a jacket? His staff members, who are all in their new jobs because of him?

My biggest concern is WHY would anyone Want to be president considering the present problems? That takes a really big EGO.

All the present problems didn't exist when he started running for the office. And are you more concerned with the person's ego and attire than the fact that he is up there trying to help our country out of the biggest mess we've been in since the Great Depression? That takes a serious ability to distract oneself from issues of substance.

It takes a big ego, sure, also big ideas, big energy, big intelligence, big aspirations, big hopes, big desires. He has bitten off a lot and I am thankful that he did. It will take every attribute that he possess to help get America back on the right track.

The kind of ego indicated by someone rejecting principles included in the document that founded our country because he decided it was best while talking to God?

Oh, wait, that guy was in office for 8 years of this century.

Or a heck of a lot of desire and vision.

yep studius and those two little girls he has too.

Will people be upset when they find out Obama did not follow the constitution and took the oath of office which is worth millions of dollars? I certainly will, and hope we find out sooner than later.

Brian,

Will people be upset when they find out Obama did not follow the constitution and took the oath of office

What the heck are you talking about? He took the oath - twice.

Please explain.

He took it again just to be sure there would be no misunderstandings among the people weather he took the oath properly or not. As did several other presidents.

Technically, White House is White. The President is not White or at least only 1/2.

My guess some GOP still offended to have a non-pure breed White in the White House.

Yes, Democrats did not stop Obama from being President that angers the GOP.

The funny thing is that only a few days ago Mr. Clark, a black man, was appointed the Chairman of the Republican Party. How is that for hypocrisy?

Notice how he is not African-American. He is not an American citizen according to Philip Berg at Obamacrimes dot com.

Brian, give it up. You are wrong. You have been proven wrong. No rational person who has looked at the issue has agreed with you. Every time you bring it up, the only thing you prove is that you lack an understanding of geography and civics. (Even Justice Thomas does not agree with you.)

Bingo JonesGirl - that is why the dressed Palin to the nines in the most expensive outfits money could buy when it could have been used to communicate to the people what their plan to make the USA better.

Had she been elected & wore a hunting outfit into the oval office her fans would have loved it. Called it "True American" attire.

Palin is a woman that spent way to much money on clothes. That's nothing new. Women have been doing that for a long time. Where would the European designers be without American women buying the newest fashion every season.

The clothing issue proves to me how easily sidetracked you are. Clothes are clothes, and no big deal, but I bet in the next little bit the press will be talking about his wife's personal style. This is the marketing before the press storm on her style, Period!

I guess some people can walk and chew gum at the same time.

Yes, they're called Democrats. You know, like Obama - the one who didn't have to put his campaign on hold during the banking crisis.

No, the Democrats are not big on dress codes in the oval office.

ESPECIALLY Clinton...

(If you don't respect your marriage vows...who would expect you to respect the office of the presidency)

(If you don't respect your marriage vows...who would expect you to respect the office of the presidency)

That's a bit of a stretch don't you think?

not over it...

NOPE! If SHE can't trust you...why should WE?

What (brief pause) ever....

mtheory,,,thank you for not making me go thru this entire post to say the same thing you said, although I just found I am at the end, thank God, I don't think I could have gone any further than this,,,how very silly that so many posted on this site that did not deal with any of the ill of society, and thing that would make a difference in the world today...tie, who cares. I am far more interested in finding out if this new golden-boy can actually solve anything that matters in the world today

I cant believe we are even having this discussion. The country is falling apart at the seems and these guys are crying about a jacket.

Unbelievable.

This is their typical behavior. They put the emphasis/attention everywhere else but where it needs to be. Worked for a long time.

Besides, THEIR country isn't falling apart. Their country got a $750 billion bailout.

Their country is doing just fine.

If you are referring to THEIR country, as in the republican junta, you are right. Their country is doing just fine.

dave,

Exactly what I meant.

Republican junta - that's a good one.

America will go down the toilet with Obama. I hope you enjoyed America while you could. This clothing distraction is just that. A distraction.

Obama's cabinet positions were the worst possible. No mention of that. Two tax evaders and a conflict of interest waiting to happen. I am hording everything from now on in case I need it in the future. Here comes some more Bush hater non-sense, Period.

Right. Brian, Obama is busy pulling America out of the toilet that Bush flushed us down after taking a huge crap on us the past 8 years.

How did you feel about your hero Bush's appointments of his good buddies with no experience in the positions they were being appointed to?

Brian wrote: "America will go down the toilet with Obama."

Should that be the case, look at the bright side.

You will have many, many roommates.

Your hatefulness and ignorance is becoming legendary.

Hell if he was Bush he would have already have taken 2 vacations at his Texas ranch.

I do believe that he has been working everyday has he not?

That is a good point Mark. Katrina was the mess it was largely because the institution created under Bush, created conflict on who was to take control of what. And of course that institution is the nationalist sounding "Homeland Security".

Brings to mind "Good job Brownie". Good job indeed, for a horse whisperer. FEMA worked great under other leaders. But FEMA of course was uncled into by a man that knew nothing. Yes indeed the appointments of Bush really should have taken the term "experience" to new heights. But as we all know the hypocrisy that exists on the right could not and would not see it that way.

You are so right Mark in bringing up "good buddies".

No, he gets it. He gets more than you.

In the United States, we are the Free World. Per the Constitution and Bill of Rights, we have the Freedom of the Press, Freedom of Religions, and so On.

Since we have all these freedoms, Obama has Freedom to Dress as he wishes without GOP want to continue Bushes Doctrine of destroying our Freedoms.

not over it...I was thinking the same thing. LOL

if Obama shows up at a State dinner with foreign diplomats wearing a "wife-beater" and cut-offs.

Or worst dressed like Don Cherry (Hockey reference his suits are some times the only reason to turn on Hockey night in Canada) or Huggy Bear (Miami Vice).

Or Dolo-mite!

Let Obama show up in shorts or what ever. Why the big deal? You have strange priorities.

Traditions will and always have changed with the times. As another poster added above, the early presidents wore stockings, short pants, and wigs. I wonder if there was this much fuss the first time a president tried to go to work in regular long pants? (Regular to us, but perhaps new and rebellious and--gasp--disrespectful at the time.) The dress uniforms of every branch of the armed forces has changedover the years. The constitution has been changed, the pledge of allegiance, and our currency has changed. Things change. Even the American flag has changed. It's not disrespectful to the past when things change. It can be disrespectful to the future when they don't. Maybe the solution to the whole whiny mess is to just keep the photographers out of the office while the president is working. That should eliminate this non-issue for good.

Good Pts Joe on the Tomb of the Unknown as there is a minimum height requirement to even be selected for that high honor. I also felt the same way when one of the College Womens teams, after being invited to the White House, wore "flip-flops" in a picture with President Bush. So to that extent, I agree w/ you as I would have put on my finest to meet the President (whoever it is in Office). But I don't think for a second former President Bush or President Obama can not do the peoples work regardless of what either chooses to wear. Not to mention President Obama is not the 1st - there are pics of other Presidents without the suggested uniform.

Show me a picture of Obama in Bermuda shorts in the Oval and then we can talk.

It's not like Obama is wearing shorts or flip flops. And what's wrong with rolling up one's sleeves? It traditionally signals people hard at work, not locker room casual.

Not to mention President Obama is not the 1st - there are pics of other Presidents without the suggested uniform.

I'd rather have a good man wearing shorts and flip flops in the office than a criminal in a nice suit. Bush broke some traditions too, like the pre-emptive war thing. The uniform of the suit and jacket was put in place by Reagan first, then discontinued under Clinton, then re-instated under Bush II. It's NOT like it was any kind of long-standing American tradition. LBJ worked in shirtsleeves a lot. You guys are making a bid deal out of something that was never any sort of real tradition, just a silly rule Reagan made up.

27.3;

The below is pasted from my Vine Column Header; I think it applies here!:

Humans strive to excel; and when they have reached their peak, and can reach no higher; they face their human limitations squarely; ...and call them "STYLE"!

The header is meant to point out the fact that when humans reach their peak, they call any achievement less than THEIR expectations for themselves personally; "Style". It is meant to point out the fact that we all have different limitations, and therefore we all have different limitations as to what we will accept; but when we reach our limits...we accept them and call them our (personal) "STYLE".

Card's personal stylings (and limitations); have absolutely NOTHING to do with Obama's; whether he agrees with them or not!!

Everone has limitations, and expectations, and their own style; it is in the placing of our own "STYLE" upon others that the world's conflicts develop!.

One respects the office by honoring its place in a constitutional system, not by wearing a suit.

Did you miss the last line of your seeded article? Even the Author agrees that "Clothes don't make the man"!!

Actually I was thinking of Nixon when I wrote the criminal remark. Amazing how quickly your mind jumped to Bush.

Of course we don't have to have a choice between honor and a nice jacket. I shouldn't have gone that way. The real point is that Reagan instituted the rule. Clinton threw it out and most of us can imagine that he wasn't dressed to protocol every minute he was in the Oval Office (nudge nude, wink wink, say no more) Bush brought the rule back and Obama has suspended it again. It's not like it was some kind of long-running American tradition. Carter wore a sweater and we all know it. Ford barely had time to wear anything. Nixon was a crook, so I really don't care if he wore Elvis' gold suit. LBJ frequently worked in shirtsleeves. It may be a shock to someone who's only been paying attention for a few years (or a few days) but it's not a real issue of respect for the office or disrespect for the quite recent 'tradition'.

I don't know if you take personal offense about this or if your just laughing as your counter goes up and up. But I respect you for moderating it. The weird thing to me is that the article took up the anti-Card angle and you seeded the article, but you take the anti-Obama angle in your opinions. I don't know that I've seen someone seed an article only to argue against it. Usually people seed articles that reinforce their own opinions. But I haven't been on the vine that long so maybe this is more commonplace than I thought. In any case, I've spent far too long on the vine today and feel like taking the dogs out to walk by the lake, so we'll talk again another time on another seed.

JohnRussell, great seed with interesting POV's.

An interesting article on trend w/ a little psychology, history, etc.

According to Mr Card and the hard core Republicans on Newsvines, all Presidents has to dressed in a suit and tie. It the only acceptable attire for President of the United States of America.

By the way, if McCain/Palin won the elections. McCain drops dead! Sarah Palin has to wear a Suite and a Tie. Right?

Yes, it does. It cut off your oxygen so you can start making irrational decisions.